[Luckycharms]

Our XC40 is being leased under my wife's name, I was hoping if I decided to but it after the lease was up, I would be eligible for the $4k credit for used EV's, unfortunately the lease buyout price is more than $25k which is the limit for the credit.

I don't think that's how it works. I believe the used EV must be purchased through a dealer. To avoid exactly what you would be trying to do.

Otherwise, you could buy a new EV, then "sell" it a year later to your spouse or child. And get the 7,500 initial credit plus the 4,000 used EV credit.

 

[Ed_S]

I don't think that's how it works. I believe the used EV must be purchased through a dealer. To avoid exactly what you would be trying to do.

Otherwise, you could buy a new EV, then "sell" it a year later to your spouse or child. And get the 7,500 initial credit plus the 4,000 used EV credit.

I see your point, but to my mind, the differences are that we leased the vehicle, we did not buy it, and we could not file for the $7500 credit, additionally we would be buying the car from the dealer (our lease is through Volvo Financial Services).

In any case, it won't matter as the lease buyout price is greater than $25k.

 

[MatteoFL]

You should be fine. The House isn't scheduled for voting until September 13th. Even if this bill gats through the Senate today, we should have a month before it can be enacted.

That is some good news, thank you! There should still be a phase in period in the bill, but I digress.

 

[improvius]

That is some good news, thank you! There should still be a phase in period in the bill, but I digress.

Oops, I think I spoke too soon, sorry:

[House Democrats] will even cut their Summer recess to vote on the Manchin-blessed package. They are expected to return to Washington in less than two weeks to take up the legislation, if the Senate is able to pass it.

House won’t go quietly

 

[MatteoFL]

Oops, I think I spoke too soon, sorry:


House won’t go quietly

If they could just hold off on approving it/Biden signing it until the end of August.

 

[ProfPlum]

I will be very ticked off if I miss out on this. I have a C40 on order and it won't be in until November. Originally the language said the current credits wouldn't change until the end of 2022, but I guess they changed that.

 

[improvius]

Looks like there may be a new rewrite incoming that will keep the current credit rules through the end of this year. Stay tuned...

I think this is an updated draft:



EDIT: I don't know what to think anymore. This does not appear to be up-to-date and I am removing the link.

 

[Todd Nicholson]

I see your point, but to my mind, the differences are that we leased the vehicle, we did not buy it, and we could not file for the $7500 credit

Didn't your dealer take the 7500 off the top when you leased? Before I bought mine, I was considering leasing and my dealer was going to take the 7500 off the top if I went that route.

 

[Ed_S]

Didn't your dealer take the 7500 off the top when you leased? Before I bought mine, I was considering leasing and my dealer was going to take the 7500 off the top if I went that route.

When we bought ours the dealer took $4k of the $7500 off the lease price, assume they pocketed the other $3500. That said, I think they play "games" with the depreciation of the vehicle when leasing a vehicle to ensure they're always in a favorable position.

To be clear, I was not advocating breaking any laws or cheating the system. If the law is written that I could buy the car coming off lease from the dealer and qualify for the $4k incentive, and I don't "lie/cheat/etc" when filing for the credit, then why wouldn't I take advantage of the credit? In any case, it's a non-issue as the buy-out from the lease will exceed $25k, which is the threshold for being able to claim the credit.

 

[pseudonymous lawyer]

NYTimes reported last night that the House plans to take up the bill this week once it clears the Senate.

Could be done by Friday.

 

[cdmoore125]

NYTimes reported last night that the House plans to take up the bill this week once it clears the Senate.

Could be done by Friday.

Senate just passed it, House expected Friday

 

[Ed_S]

So, I'm not trying to start a political discussion, but if this bill was in place in 2021, we would not have an EV, well maybe an outside chance for the Mach-E, though even if we did decide to get a Mach-E we might have been unsuccessful with the backlog that Ford is still working to catch up on.

I like the idea of favoring US companies since the rebate is coming from US tax $$, but if the goal is to encourage EV adoption & transistion away from ICE vehicles, IMO this isn't the bill that does that. Not interested in Tesla or Bolt or VW ID.4 (no criticism intended for Tesla/Bolt/VW owners), just saying that for our family and circumstances, we would not own an EV under the current bill.

Again, keeping politics out of this, just stating that IMO this bill does not encourage EV adoption, at least to us.

 

[Eugene M Stoner]

So, I'm not trying to start a political discussion, but if this bill was in place in 2021, we would not have an EV, well maybe an outside chance for the Mach-E, though even if we did decide to get a Mach-E we might have been unsuccessful with the backlog that Ford is still working to catch up on.

I like the idea of favoring US companies since the rebate is coming from US tax $$, but if the goal is to encourage EV adoption & transition away from ICE vehicles, IMO this isn't the bill that does that. Not interested in Tesla or Bolt or VW ID.4 (no criticism intended for Tesla/Bolt/VW owners), just saying that for our family and circumstances, we would not own an EV under the current bill.

Again, keeping politics out of this, just stating that IMO this bill does not encourage EV adoption, at least to us.

You're not wrong at all. This is a US manufacturing stimulus package at best. If the goal were to help accelerate EV adoption efforts would be made to incentivize even more sales not less. Less cars qualify under this plan and less buyers qualify. When you look at the price of an EV and then factor in a $300k AGI cut off for those filing joint you have really gone backwards here. Can somebody weigh in if they know the answer to this. Does any vehicle currently being sold qualify for both the full $7,500 if the current bill were law today?

 

[Stephen Cerruti]

Again, keeping politics out of this, just stating that IMO this bill does not encourage EV adoption, at least to us.

I think the original limit on number of vehicles addressed the true purpose, that is too promote the development and production of EVs, not to encourage adoption. The economics of EV ownership does that on it's own.

Most of the money under the former system was going to start heading to China. I'm not a huge fan of more money going to Tesla and GM, but I am a fan of the development of EV technology in the US.

I am shopping around for our second EV and this is impacting that process. I believe that ultimately foreign manufacturers will drop prices to keep them competitive without the rebate when possible.

There are waiting lists currently so the government does not actually need to encourage purchase. If the transition to EV is to include US workers, then we need to work to catch VW, Hyundai and the Chinese companies.

 

[Pat F]

Can somebody weigh in if they know the answer to this. Does any vehicle currently being sold qualify for both the full $7,500 if the current bill were law today?

The lower end EVs qualify. Volvo will not make it under the current bill IF the rules of the draft remained the same. This video helped me understand the draft rules the best. Again, I do not know if anything changed:

 

[pseudonymous lawyer]

You're not wrong at all. This is a US manufacturing stimulus package at best. If the goal were to help accelerate EV adoption efforts would be made to incentivize even more sales not less. Less cars qualify under this plan and less buyers qualify. When you look at the price of an EV and then factor in a $300k AGI cut off for those filing joint you have really gone backwards here. Can somebody weigh in if they know the answer to this. Does any vehicle currently being sold qualify for both the full $7,500 if the current bill were law today?

Someone on Reddit put together this list:

https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/wdjax3
Wouldn't take it as dispositive authority given source. Certainly there will be vehicles that qualify for the full $7,500, though.

The dealer assignment provision makes the credit more useful to middle income taxpayers and below and seems likely to have an impact.

It seems the idea is not to provide a tax incentive to people who are likely to buy an EV anyway. There's certainly a good argument that the income cutoffs are too low, putting aside the also excellent argument that the incentive should be across the board given how urgent it is that mass adoption get going for realzies.

The bill will make the credit available to cars that don't get it anymore, in particular established Tesla and GM models.

I myself am racing to get the XC40 Recharge I was expecting to take delivery of next week under contract this week so that I can get the credit under the wire.

But not so clear that this is less of an incentive to buy an EV overall. It changes the distribution of the incentive. Maybe that's good, maybe not; depends on preferences and point of view. I bet on some Tesla owners forum, people are very excited right now.

¯\(ツ)/¯

 

[pseudonymous lawyer]

The lower end EVs qualify. Volvo will not make it under the current bill IF the rules of the draft remained the same. This video helped me understand the draft rules the best. Again, I do not know if anything changed:

The Senate adopted it. The text of the bill is baked at this point.

Volvo won't be in a position to meet the geographic requirements anytime soon.

 

[pseudonymous lawyer]

There are waiting lists currently so the government does not actually need to encourage purchase.

This was explicitly one of the reasons Manchin wanted to scrap the credits altogether earlier in his negotiations with Schumer.

 

[Ed_S]

Speaking for our family, we had a Honda CR-V coming off lease in 2021, and the decision was to either buy the car (it was worth about $6k more than the lease buyout), buy a used 2018 "luxury" SUV (BMW X3, Audi Q5, MB, etc.) or buy an EV that had the "luxury" features we were looking for.

Since the Audi Q4 Etron was (still is?) vaporware in the US, the only other EV options we considered were the XC40 and the Mach-E. We test drove the Mach-E, nice enough car, but we weren't fans of the interior and the giant screen hanging in the middle. That left the XC40, at first I was turned off by the mileage estimate, but thanks to this forum and other internet searches, decided that the range was enough for >90% of our typical usage, and we still have an ICE car if we needed to take a road trip. Took it for a test drive, and contacted the dealer a day later to discuss purchasing it. We've been fortunate that our XC40 didn't have any serious issues, both of us LOVE driving the car, and range no longer concerns us.

Sad that with this bill, our option would have been to buy a used 2018 "luxury" ICE SUV, oh well, life goes on . . .

Update, forgot to mention that in NJ (where we live), there is no sales tax (6.625%) on EV purchases or leases, regardless of income, nice perk to help push people into an EV purchase if they're on the fence.

 

[jay_man2]

The EV driving experience in the XC40 and C40 is so far superior to an ICE vehicle that I will never buy another ICE, with or without a tax credit.