[Deanman71]

UK driver of the Volvo XC40 Hybrid Recharge, petrol fuel cheaper than charging! Or am I missing something!
Cost to charge at home on a standard variable tariff in the uk at 33.33p kwh = 350p, range in winter = 12miles therefore cost per mile is 29.16p.
Petrol cost 139.99plitre x 4.546 = 636.39p gallon / 43mpg = 14.7p per mile or on Recharge mode 639.39p /28mpg = 22.72p per mile.
Even with the best range in summer of 24miles using EV this works out at 350p / 24 = 14.7p per mile.
Energy costs are making the car too expensive to run on battery. Beginning to think this is s bad purchase. Lovely car but the EV side is disappointing, too expensive and not enough range.
Anyone seeing the same results.

 

[bogiesan]

Not in Idaho, USA, where Idaho Power has the third lowest rates in the country. And I'm using the BEV. Sell the car.

 

[morphroc]

The mild hybrid is the most economical option (similar MPG to the PHEV but much cheaper purchase price), the EV is the best for the environment, and I think that means the PHEV is only a good choice if you need to take frequent long trips (gas engine) but also do many short trips that you'd like to run on full electric (even if it's more expensive). Seems like a niche choice.

 

[merthyrkitt]

Interesting post. I have the same car. Have you actually measured the amount of electricity needed to charge the battery from empty to full? My thinking is there are normally assumed to be energy losses in the charging process of 10% to 15% , and the net capacity of the battery is also probably 10% less than the 10.7KwH stated by Volvo. So a calculated figure may be different to a real one. Not that's going to detract from your argument and your calculations and reasoning seem ok to me. Perhaps in winter on short journeys the petrol consumption might not be as good as the figure you use and I reckon getting 20 miles on battery on average.

I tend to keep the car charged not giving any thought to the comparative costs but enjoying the quieter and smoother drive on local journeys. I know using the car as a normal hybrid can be very economical. I did a very long slow crawl across central London recently with a depleted battery and got 44mpg.

I'm going to look into this myself. I'll start by not charging the car for a few days and see what the petrol consumption is like on my normal local journeys.. Thanks for raising it.

 

[Deanman71]

Interesting post. I have the same car. Have you actually measured the amount of electricity needed to charge the battery from empty to full? My thinking is there are normally assumed to be energy losses in the charging process of 10% to 15% , and the net capacity of the battery is also probably 10% less than the 10.7KwH stated by Volvo. So a calculated figure may be different to a real one. Not that's going to detract from your argument and your calculations and reasoning seem ok to me. Perhaps in winter on short journeys the petrol consumption might not be as good as the figure you use and I reckon getting 20 miles on battery on average.

I tend to keep the car charged not giving any thought to the comparative costs but enjoying the quieter and smoother drive on local journeys. I know using the car as a normal hybrid can be very economical. I did a very long slow crawl across central London recently with a depleted battery and got 44mpg.

I'm going to look into this myself. I'll start by not charging the car for a few days and see what the petrol consumption is like on my normal local journeys.. Thanks for raising it.

The electric mode drive is as you say very smooth and I prefer to drive it in electric for short runs, which I did when first purchased. Charging at every opportunity. Indicated mpg was 128mpg. Great I thought, then when the UK energy costs went up 3 fold, I started to look at the figures. It just doesn’t make sense to plug in and charge, I do on occasion plug in to maintain battery health, and suffer worse fuel mpg to recharge to maintain battery at mid charge, but put on Hold and drive using cheaper fuel during winter months when battery range is deplorable, 12miles!

 

[Deanman71]

Full charge is 10.7kw which equates to £3.55.

 

[merthyrkitt]

Is that what you've measured coming from the electric supply? I will check that in a few days..

 

[Deanman71]

Is that what you've measured coming from the electric supply? I will check that in a few days..

That’s what my Easee one charger consumption states. This is from 0% to 100% charge. Charge time 3hrs 55min.

 

[merthyrkitt]

It's an interesting exercise.. Today I used up a full battery in 20 miles at a cost of £3.25. Outside temp was around 11 Deg. Mondays I have a busy routine of very many short journeys in town traffic. I calculate I'll need to get 42mpg over the same journeys for petrol to be cheaper at the best price I can get which is 148p a litre. I'll do the same journey next Monday starting wth a depleted battery to see but I've a feeling the electric will still be cheaper for me by not much.

 

[Deanman71]

It's an interesting exercise.. Today I used up a full battery in 20 miles at a cost of £3.25. Outside temp was around 11 Deg. Mondays I have a busy routine of very many short journeys in town traffic. I calculate I'll need to get 42mpg over the same journeys for petrol to be cheaper at the best price I can get which is 148p a litre. I'll do the same journey next Monday starting wth a depleted battery to see but I've a feeling the electric will still be cheaper for me by not much.

Did you set your tripometer for the journey? I was going off the indicated battery range which stated 24miles for a while, but when I checked against the tripometer I only got 12miles at about 7DegC. I’ll do another check myself and see what I get.

 

[Deanman71]

Did you set your tripometer for the journey? I was going off the indicated battery range which stated 24miles for a while, but when I checked against the tripometer I only got 12miles at about 7DegC. I’ll do another check myself and see what I get.

If I got 20 miles that wouldn’t be to bad but I haven’t previously in this cold weather. To charge the battery fully uses about 10.7kw, which at 0.3333p standard variable rate is £3.56 / 20miles is more like 17.8p a mile, still reasonable with fuel cost here averaging 143.99 x 4.546= 654.57 / 42 = 15.58p a mile. Still cheaper than charging, just. If you drive whilst not recharging and not using battery I’ve been getting 42 to 43 mpg. Fill up at Costco and it’s 137.99 per litre.

 

[LDIR_16384]

If I got 20 miles that wouldn’t be to bad but I haven’t previously in this cold weather. To charge the battery fully uses about 10.7kw, which at 0.3333p standard variable rate is £3.56 / 20miles is more like 17.8p a mile, still reasonable with fuel cost here averaging 143.99 x 4.546= 654.57 / 42 = 15.58p a mile. Still cheaper than charging, just. If you drive whilst not recharging and not using battery I’ve been getting 42 to 43 mpg. Fill up at Costco and it’s 137.99 per litre.

These electric consumption figures are similar to my old Outlander PHEV. I think the only option I'd have now to improve on that would be to move to Octopus Go which will easily cover the 11KWh in the cheap rate window (22 EV miles in the summer, 11 miles in the winter). Depends though if those savings are not offset by any increase the house uses on peak rate compared to the cheapest standard tariff available.

 

[Deanman71]

These electric consumption figures are similar to my old Outlander PHEV. I think the only option I'd have now to improve on that would be to move to Octopus Go which will easily cover the 11KWh in the cheap rate window (22 EV miles in the summer, 11 miles in the winter). Depends though if those savings are not offset by any increase the house uses on peak rate compared to the cheapest standard tariff available.

Only problem is you can’t switch to an off peak rate! I’m with Shell Energy, only rate available is the standard variable. It’s not a competitive market anymore whist energy companies are not offering fixed deals or any incentives to swap. Basically, we are stuck with what you’ve got.

 

[merthyrkitt]

Deanman71, yes I used the trip to determine range. I drove in eco mode and B on the gear selector until the car started the engine. My refill of the battery took a measured 9.55 kWh from the mains supply.

 

[Deanman71]

Deanman71, yes I used the trip to determine range. I drove in eco mode and B on the gear selector until the car started the engine. My refill of the battery took a measured 9.55 kWh from the mains supply.

I’ve charged mine fully and will do a EV test run using the trip to get the range I get. Not using car today, forecast is 6Deg high tomorrow, so not expecting anything near 20miles but we’ll see. I use B on gear selection but will check my car mode selection as well. Did you have any heated seats or steering wheel on?

 

[merthyrkitt]

I’ve charged mine fully and will do a EV test run using the trip to get the range I get. Not using car today, forecast is 6Deg high tomorrow, so not expecting anything near 20miles but we’ll see. I use B on gear selection but will check my car mode selection as well. Did you have any heated seats or steering wheel on?

No, nothing. Climate is set to 20 deg (I use an Individual mode based on Eco but with Hybrid Climate - otherwise the screen mists). This morning I went out - 11 Deg outside - with no battery charge. 3.3 miles each way in lightish town traffic. The app shows 35mpg out and 38mpg back. Not near the 42 mpg I think will make petrol as cheap as electric. But I'll leave the battery uncharged for a few days and record some other journeys.

 

[merthyrkitt]

Yesterday I did multiple local trips totalling 20 miles on petrol ( battery depleted but still using Individual mode and B). I have calculated from the logs that I averaged 25.6mpg, used 0.78 gallon of fuel at a cost of £6.73. Mondays journeys of 20 miles on battery cost £3.25 in similar temperature conditions.

For my pattern of local journeys electricity is still half the price of petrol. A very useful exercise - data and calculations available. I'd be interest in your results Deanman71.

 

[Deanman71]

No, nothing. Climate is set to 20 deg (I use an Individual mode based on Eco but with Hybrid Climate - otherwise the screen mists). This morning I went out - 11 Deg outside - with no battery charge. 3.3 miles each way in lightish town traffic. The app shows 35mpg out and 38mpg back. Not near the 42 mpg I think will make petrol as cheap as electric. But I'll leave the battery uncharged for a few days and record some other journeys.

 

[Deanman71]

[/QUOTE

Yesterday I did multiple local trips totalling 20 miles on petrol ( battery depleted but still using Individual mode and B). I have calculated from the logs that I averaged 25.6mpg, used 0.78 gallon of fuel at a cost of £6.73. Mondays journeys of 20 miles on battery cost £3.25 in similar temperature conditions.

For my pattern of local journeys electricity is still half the price of petrol. A very useful exercise - data and calculations available. I'd be interest in your results Deanman71.

I charged the battery to 100%, selected Pure Eco Drive mode, and saw an indicated 27mile range, never saw above 24mile in Hybrid every day use mode before. I did a 6.5mile journey at 2Deg, then the return 6.5mile at 4Deg, indicated battery range left was 7 mile.
next day I depleted the battery in 4.5 miles, so total range I got was 16.5miles. Better range in Pure Eco than Hybrid everyday mode 👍
However, at £3.50 to charge fully that’s 21.5p a mile, which is better than I was getting, I will try again when temperatures are above 10Deg. The fuel figures as you’ve said depend on the mpg return figures, I have had 42mpg with battery on hold and no recharge, but on recharge have had as low as 26mpg. At 26mpg which you got, with fuel at 142.99 a litre equates to 25p per mile so it is cheaper to charge with electricity at those fuel figures. Where you recharging the battery when you got 26mpg?

 

[merthyrkitt]

I've never used the charge option. I also give no credence to the range readout. I've had it increase by 2 miles just turning the car off and on again and then reducing by 2 miles in a few hundred yards.. During the journeys there was the usual electric consumption and regeneration in the app trip details which generally cancelled each other out. Temperature has a big effect on petrol consumption too. With a cold engine a 2 mile trip to the shops recorded 20.4mpg, whereas the return journey 15 minutes later recorded 27.7mpg.